AAA OW & Coach of the Year

[MaleMatMaid]

There are a lot of great coaches out there, who work hard and do a great job. Having been a competitor all of my life, and coaching over the last several years my take on the issue is simple. South was favored to win it all, the reason they were favored is because they have a line up that is stellar. The reason they have a stellar line up is because those kids are coached to be champions. Champions are built, and it is something that South seems to do year after year. Hitting the expectation set, when that expectation is to win should not be punished. There are a ton of teams and coaches out there that want what South has, but until they can take it from them......my vote would go to their coach as COY.

I agree with you that there are a lot of good coaches in our state and also that there shouldn't be a punishment for achieving what you are expected to do. It is a lot more difficult to meet the expectations if the expectations are to win every time out. These are still kids and sometimes the pressure can be too much for them. It is shown every year. Noah Adams was supposed to win this year, he did, and was earned the MOW. No argument at all on this end but he did was he was supposed to do. He shouldn't be punished for it.

[Gator]

If you want to look at overachievers, Hampshire is currently sitting in 5th place after not being ranked at all. I also disagree that South's coach, Shaun Smith, should not win the COY because he has 9 assistants. He is the man running the show and making all the tough decisions for the team.

[Bucktail]

Amusing that you mention university in this scenario except not at all. So, last season whenever South had all underclassmen, zero seniors, five freshmen starters that all did well, two in which finished runner-up in their respective weight classes and still ran away with the team title. But, the COY still went to another team's coach. Your logic of since South was and is favored to win their coach doesn't deserve it holds no merit. Independence ran away with the team title just like they were favored to do and who won COY...let me think...hmm was it Cliff Warden? If you ever won anything then you would know and understand how much work it takes to actually stay on top, but it is obvious that you have never been there. With no longer having a dog in the fight bc don't forget I was jv and then quit, it doesn't effect me either way but it really isn't me that spews all of this hate, it obvious that it is you and others like you that are clearly jealous. Sad. Coaches shouldn't even get a vote. It should be done like the OVAC and given to the coaches that win their division. Except they had trouble following their own rules this year too, so maybe not

The lens with which you look at things is clearly slanted. I never said South was undeserving. Although I don't recall who won it, I thought Coach Smith deserved it last year, as that was, as you pointed out, quite a performance. If you are capable of looking beyond your slant, you'll note I was using South, St. Albans, & even University to state a point, that there are those who look to give the coach of the year to a team who had the grace of overachieving in the perspective eyes of the voters and noting that south didn't even have the capable luxury of being in that position. St. Albans and University have achieved more that people expected of them, thus, make it easier to help develop that point. It happens in the pros and colleges ranks all the time. You read it through your slanted glasses and took affront, and in doing so, missed the point. As if, my opinion should be subservient to yours, when neither has a vote. Please learn to read with writers intent and not through your slant.

My views aren't slanted. I agree with you that in some circumstances when teams overachieve that should be taken into account. But St. Albans and University have been ranked where they've been bc of short sided coaches not voting for them not bc of their performance. It is obvious that those two teams are good and have performed well during the season. I don't think that they are overachieving at all. They've been undervalued. Maybe the teams that have been ahead of them all season are simply underachieving which is possible or in all reality maybe they just weren't as good as "coaches" thought and maybe St. Albans and university are doing exactly what they should be doing. If your view about South is that they are doing exactly what they are supposed to do then maybe it is the same for every other teams as well.

Your point in this last is quite possibly valid, but it goes to show that the voters perspective matters. The coaches are the voters & the rankers, so it is their assessed value one has to work with. So it matters how they see it and if meeting high expectations are enough. I forgot about Hampshire, maybe they would have been a better illustration point, yet the point remains. I matters how the voter feels and there are often differing opinions about it. Some think Huggins should win because his team's performance was higher than predicted, but then you have Bill Self who was a champion with the expectation behind his team. The point I was making exists in every sport. I see all sides, the team with high expectations, the underachiever, and the surprise performer.

[south 77]

There is more of being a Coach then the mat on . Should also take into consideration off the mat. therefore Coach Smith deserves the award

[brentsams]

But South does not have a coach or even two they have ten or more so when then that is figured in .... the guy doing it all by their lonesome or with little help often gets the nod!

Are Coach Warden or Coach Archer doing it by themselves? With those two coaches winning the past two years or more, just proved your statement false. I think they have staffs of five or six coaches. And don't take me wrong, I respect them both and they are very deserving of the award.

I also appreciate the coach doing it all on his own. It takes a special kind of dedication to persevere by yourself. But I disagree with the statement of the large staff. The handful of times I had to pop in on a South practice, I never did see 10 coaches in the practice room. Appearances during match day can be deceiving. Of South's many coaches, I only saw two of them there every time that I would consider full time assistants (Dave Jeffrey and Bruce Martin). The rest are part time assistants with jobs and college classes that only made practices two or three times a week, and then, maybe only a partial practice at that.

Anybody remember the malice towards Larry Shaw and the Oak Glen program. How many times was he looked over because of "Inherited Talent"? And look how Oak Glen has dropped off since Coach Shaw's retirement from being perennial champion to title contender.

You also have to consider today's coaching guidelines that you can't just pull an alumni off the street to come workout with a wrestler. They have to be approved through the state and O.K. by the administration. South is blessed to have dedicated former wrestlers that give back to the program by going through the coaching classes to be approved .

In my opinion, South's Coach Smith is as hard working as any coach I've been around and is deserving of being considered for the Coaches Award. In my opinion, he has raised the bar at South (is that possible?) and to have the majority of his wrestlers ranked in the top ten for two consecutive years is quite a feat. He is not one to just delegate but takes it upon himself to be involved in all aspects of the program, from rubbing elbows with the wrestlers during combat, running drills, helping with booster fund raisers, etc. To not consider Coach Smith because of "inherited talent", "large staff" is ludicrous.

[vortexfan]

There are several ways to look at this COY but I really admire the coaches that succeed with small number of wrestlers (students) and limited budgets to function with. Bluefiekd comes to mind this year, and also yes St Albans, University and Hamphshire. Had Coach Smith been awarded it last year with all underclassmen and (this years lineup was something to watch) this wouldn't be much of discussion. South does have a large staff and great feeder programs, which makes the teaching part a little easier but still a lot of day to day operational decisions. I am betting Parkersburg will be strong in the next 2-3 years and then Coach Way will get his turn.

[noshowjoe]

I would give the OW to Pine or Haynes but statistically Allman had the best tournament.

[south 77]

Easier Get real. The coach are all the time showing new move. Getting them ready for tournaments. Doing the little things that it take to be number 1

[aacoach119]

mow Caleb Haynes with out a doubt Coach of the year Darren Gilifin. He has turned St Albans wrestling program around. But lets not forget Greg Humpheys one of the nicest men youll ever met. Josh Humphrey could be up for that award as well. But the freshman was on point. Congratulations Caleb

[SingleLegTrump]

It's quite possible Haynes has had the best performance so far but there are quite a few candidates it would be hard to choose just one. And all the points being raised on here are actually good ones as to why Shaun Smith hasn't been awarded coach of the year, however, I'm pretty sure they aren't truly influencing the voting. The real influence is "we don't like south or their obnoxious fans, let's give it to someone else"

[TrueSouthFanInPburg]

very well said bucktail ! i agree with you 100% femailmatmaid has a tendency to not understand what people on here are talking about. It's as if he tries to find a way to twist things and take them the wrong way. Then he criticizes people and makes fun of them on here. he stated that i'm hated on here more than him and that i never have anything good to say about anyone. that's insane if you go back and look at all of my posts, most of them do have good things to say about the wrestlers. i'm totally surprised that he hasn't been banned from posting on here. i have been reading posts on here for several years and i have never come across anyone as rude, disrespective and impolite as femalematmaid. i guess being a quitter has made him this way. with all this being said i want to wish all the wrestlers in state part 2 good luck, especially T.J. Lambiotte, Zane Hinzman and Jarritt Flinn ! I'm sure femalematmaid will still think this is also not a good thing for me to say. Femalematmaid desperately needs help.

[mscoach57]

I do not coach in Wood County nor do I have a team in the Wood County tournament. I am never in the running for any award, I do the best with what I am dealt. I am however friends with one of the Edison coaches and when I read the comments on here by the wood county middle school tournament director it reminded me of the story I was told two or three years ago in the wood county middle school tournament the Edison Team set the all time scoring record and the head coach tied the record for most tournament wins by a single coach. The third place coach got the award.

Goes to show that coaches vote for a variety of things that we may not understand, appreciate, or even respect. If Parkersburg South wins there will be many who think their Coach should win the award while others will vote for others. If South set the scoring record there would be people who still did not vote for him. I never met Coach Oldham but I did meet Coach Manning. I wonder what they would think about what the awards have become. Coach Archer gets a lot of rude comments and his dad does too, I have never asked him but I have to think that the last thing in the world he wants after finishing the tournament and finding his team behind other teams on the scoreboard is to be given an award that he did not lobby for and listen to snide comments.

[ZZChooseTop]

The thread has shifted to South again. Back to my original question were ballots circulated in Huntington or will they be circulated in Fairmont? I might have screwed it up but according the team results and doing a quick run through of the three brackets it looks like Spring Valley, Preston, Princeton, and Capital do not have wrestlers participating in Fairmont? Will those coaches even bother to vote? Can they vote by proxy?

I follow A/AA more than AAA but since the thread has been hijacked anyway let me throw another team at you

Martinsburg scored 3 points at 2016 state tournament. This year they have scored 15 already and may score more! Name another school who increased its score 5x. South scored 198.5 they won't score 1000 this year. St Albans scored 99 last year, even with the points they are going to get in Fairmont they will not hit the 500 mark! Someone mentioned Hampshire coming in with 30 last year think they will hit 150?

Before one of the South people or St Albans people point out the obvious, I'm being sarcastic to illustrate a point. Politicians justify their votes with valid but somewhat sketchy numbers. People on here have made a case for South getting COY. St Albans getting COY. Even Hampshire getting COY. I have used the same tournament stats to make an argument for Martinsburg getting COY. My grandpa used to say, Figures can lie and liars can figure.

[highleghillary]

Best coaching staff in the state in south, whether some of you on here want to hear that or not, or even like any of them is one thing. But the truth of the matter is that team has 6 dudes that competed at the college level, and Brent I would enjoy this season because from what I heard, those practices will be closed to everybody next year. Smith is in control of the program and tells his coaches what he wants done and when he's not getting it done, his coaches are. South wrestling team is fundamentally done through smith's philosophy and every decision made is strictly through smith. And it's a shame some people, especially some fans from South even try to undermine that. People ought to be greatful that a community has so many talented young men that take their time to guide young men in a path that they once we're drew into and keep the tradition in winning team titles. For some of you coaches that haven't voted for shaun, well, that's petty. I get it, I don't think he should win it every year. The team'so coach that wins it year in and year out shouldn't win coy every year, that tarnishes the title. But the fact that he wouldn't be voted for the second year in his second year with his second team title is mind blowing. Quit being so partisan and hating, if you don't like it then do something about it and beat them. Souths leadership structure is like a buearacracy, with former great south wrestlers working under Smith who is in deed the HEAD big Dawg

[highleghillary]

Before ppl get mad......bottom portion of the last comment is directed toward the coaches who vote.....top portion is mainly directed toward some fans....and if you think it's about you....then it probably is

[MaleMatMaid]

very well said bucktail ! i agree with you 100% femailmatmaid has a tendency to not understand what people on here are talking about. It's as if he tries to find a way to twist things and take them the wrong way. Then he criticizes people and makes fun of them on here. he stated that i'm hated on here more than him and that i never have anything good to say about anyone. that's insane if you go back and look at all of my posts, most of them do have good things to say about the wrestlers. i'm totally surprised that he hasn't been banned from posting on here. i have been reading posts on here for several years and i have never come across anyone as rude, disrespective and impolite as femalematmaid. i guess being a quitter has made him this way. with all this being said i want to wish all the wrestlers in state part 2 good luck, especially T.J. Lambiotte, Zane Hinzman and Jarritt Flinn ! I'm sure femalematmaid will still think this is also not a good thing for me to say. Femalematmaid desperately needs help.

No I just know how to accurately interpret things and stupidity. Which the radar lights up as bright as ever whenever you post your "thoughtful" comments. Go away. Good luck to my former teammates!!!!

[noshowjoe]

If i'm not mistaken South does have a coach and and a few wrestlers in the running for these awards.
So why wouldnt they be talked about good or bad in this conversation.

[highleghillary]

The thread has shifted to South again. Back to my original question were ballots circulated in Huntington or will they be circulated in Fairmont? I might have screwed it up but according the team results and doing a quick run through of the three brackets it looks like Spring Valley, Preston, Princeton, and Capital do not have wrestlers participating in Fairmont? Will those coaches even bother to vote? Can they vote by proxy?

I follow A/AA more than AAA but since the thread has been hijacked anyway let me throw another team at you

Martinsburg scored 3 points at 2016 state tournament. This year they have scored 15 already and may score more! Name another school who increased its score 5x. South scored 198.5 they won't score 1000 this year. St Albans scored 99 last year, even with the points they are going to get in Fairmont they will not hit the 500 mark! Someone mentioned Hampshire coming in with 30 last year think they will hit 150?

Before one of the South people or St Albans people point out the obvious, I'm being sarcastic to illustrate a point. Politicians justify their votes with valid but somewhat sketchy numbers. People on here have made a case for South getting COY. St Albans getting COY. Even Hampshire getting COY. I have used the same tournament stats to make an argument for Martinsburg getting COY. My grandpa used to say, Figures can lie and liars can figure.

Couldn't be more right! Though with policy, there are statistical as well as emotional morality components that push for decision making or casting votes. It just seems to me that alot of ppl vote with their emotions while manipulating certain stats rather than statistics that effectively matter.

[highleghillary]

If i'm not mistaken South does have a coach and and a few wrestlers in the running for these awards.
So why wouldnt they be talked about good or bad in this conversation.

Ofcourse there is one in the running. This conversation isn't about that. It's about who ought to win coy and this year is a hands down decision, not even close. And that's nothing against the other coaches at all. It's just his turn. And if some of you who don't like the fact that I used the term "turn," look at the past awards and think about it.

[noshowjoe]

Although i tend to pull for South just a little bit i would have no problem with those fellas across the river winning
C.O.Y they did a great job this year as always.

[MaleMatMaid]

Although i tend to pull for South just a little bit i would have no problem with those fellas across the river winning
C.O.Y they did a great job this year as always.

for what exactly? Coming in 2nd place to South...again?

[vortexfan]

I would have no problem with Coach Way winning COY; PHS probably overachieved with what experience they had this year! I think Ripley coaches do a good job with the small school competing with the larger schools

[noshowjoe]

No sir not for 2nd but trying for 1st and coming up a little short and for there dedication to there
wrestlers,school, community,and each other.

[aaacoach28]

I think Jym Shorts should be coach of the year. His team finished last and he over achieved doing that. Vortex your reasoning make no sense to me. How is placing anything below first considered COY. Kinda like voting MOW for finishing 5th.

[Frank Stein]

COY Anthony Emana SV
MOW Caleb Haynes SA

And it doesn't matter what happens in Fairmont.

[Gator]

COY Anthony Emana SV
MOW Caleb Haynes SA

And it doesn't matter what happens in Fairmont.

7th place team for COY? Hmmmm.............

[MaleMatMaid]

I would have no problem with Coach Way winning COY; PHS probably overachieved with what experience they had this year! I think Ripley coaches do a good job with the small school competing with the larger schools

Probably overachieved? Wow! Another person with excellent logic. I'm taking it that you're joking right?

[MaleMatMaid]

No sir not for 2nd but trying for 1st and coming up a little short and for there dedication to there
wrestlers,school, community,and each other.

Hahaha another joke right? An award for trying? This is high school not pee wee. A safe space will be provided for you soon

[noshowjoe]

MaleMatMaid it sounds to me like your the one looking for a safe space.
Dont be so combative and you might finde a few friends on here.

[mscoach132]

Best coaching staff in the state in south, whether some of you on here want to hear that or not, or even like any of them is one thing. But the truth of the matter is that team has 6 dudes that competed at the college level, and Brent I would enjoy this season because from what I heard, those practices will be closed to everybody next year. Smith is in control of the program and tells his coaches what he wants done and when he's not getting it done, his coaches are. South wrestling team is fundamentally done through smith's philosophy and every decision made is strictly through smith. And it's a shame some people, especially some fans from South even try to undermine that. People ought to be greatful that a community has so many talented young men that take their time to guide young men in a path that they once we're drew into and keep the tradition in winning team titles. For some of you coaches that haven't voted for shaun, well, that's petty. I get it, I don't think he should win it every year. The team'so coach that wins it year in and year out shouldn't win coy every year, that tarnishes the title. But the fact that he wouldn't be voted for the second year in his second year with his second team title is mind blowing. Quit being so partisan and hating, if you don't like it then do something about it and beat them. Souths leadership structure is like a buearacracy, with former great south wrestlers working under Smith who is in deed the HEAD big Dawg

Not sure how I overlooked this one, but it's hilarious, especially the 'Quit being so partisan and hating' part. Talk about the pot calling the kettle black. I wish they would make a forum category for South Wrestling, so all you guys could get on there and pat yourselves on the back, and the rest of us didn't have to read about it. While South may very well have the best coaching staff in AAA, saying its the best in the state is a bit much, its a lot easier to win with a huge enrollment and an unlimited budget. No names mentioned but smaller schools are winning with a lot less to work with.